sir hojle sa sinabi nyong ito:

Possibly na ganun ang mangyari kaleiope kasi mapapatunayan din nila na tunay din ang apoy. kasi nga dahil illusion na lang nila ang ating Dyos, eh baka illusion na rin nila ang apoy.

sana sumagot yung mga atheist sa panig nila. kasi para kasing lihis po ang sagot nyo. wala po sa logic. hindi na po siguro kailangan magsunog pa ng paa para lamang malaman kung gaano kainit ang apoy.

well, sorry kalieope di ko mapilit ung di mo makuha ang logic nito.
so kung alam nila ang init ng apoy, dapat din nilang malalaman na mas mainit pa ang impyerno. at itong impyerno ay Iisa lamang ang gumawa nito at makakapagtapon sa sino mang hindi naniniwala sa Kanya. So, kung ayaw nila sa pinakamainit na lugar na ito, mainit pa kaysa apoy, then they should rethink their positions and beliefs these days. or else!
it is good to have a "holy and reverent fear" than to have no fear at all to our Holy Righteous God - who is also the God of Justice.

sa sinabi nyong ito:
di ko naman kayo nakikita at di ko nakikita ang puso mo. pero ang thread po ay tumutukoy sa isang paniniwala na immoral at evil at against God. at ito ay atheism or non believing of the existence of God. so kung sino ang sumusamampataya nito ay sya rin ay magiging immoral at sabi nga (di ako may sabi ha?), mapupunta sa kadagat kagatang apoy.

kaya nga po sir hojle eh, di mo mahuhusgahan kung lahat dito na umaamin na sila ay atheist ay totoong atheist kasi di nyo po sila kilala, di nyo po sila nakikita. kaya po ako nagtataka na basta basta nyo na lang iminungkahi na magsusunog sila sa paa nila. siguro po masyado lang po kayong seryoso. :)

at tungkol naman sa mga bulag, hindi rin po kita maintindihan dun. oo nga, see no evil pero di rin po natin masasabing wala silang kasalanan. dapat siguro di mo nilalahat.

tagala lang na di ako makakahusga. but remember this, na out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. so if someone confess that he is an atheist then he himself convicts himself. so it is not me ang nanghuhusga kundi sya lang mismo sa sarili nya.
at wag mong gawing biro ang hindi nakakabiro. don't endanger yourself if you can. kaya nga sabi ni St Paul; "watch you life and doctrine closely". kaya di dapat pinagbibiro ito.

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Ho(ly)J(ESUS for)l(ife)e(ternal)
Holy Father, give us the spirit to understand Your words. Give us The Spirit to faithfully follow it. Lord come and reign! Free and save all Filipino brothers! Through Your Holy and Mighty Name JESUS we pray.Ame3X

@Hojle

I congratulate you for successfully trolling this thread and others like it. Ahahahhaha.

This thread started out with calm, non-judgemental and critical/semi-critical posts from other people. But unfortunately your bigotry has killed it. Honestly good sir to a certain extent, I respect people like you. People who are firm in their beliefs, people who read and know what they are talking about. However, you are brainwashed, a bigot, and have excessive amounts of self-righteousness which I, and other people here, makes it hard or even impossible to even have the slightest amount of respect for you.

The topic says "Atheism", the sub-heading: "The idea of believing that no supreme deity/deities exist". And this is a forum. Each is entitled to his/her opinion and to be able to discuss that opinion. Like others you have done this--only in an exorbitant manner--to the point where you sound like a pharisee. This is a very disgusting and dangerous thing for a Christian like you.

I do not have a religion. But I do acknowledge the existence of the text and doctrines which you present and I respect that. And for the sake of discussion/argument/debate, I still keep an open mind to its validity. Moreover on a personal level, I don't have any problems with the Bible.

Again the problem lies with people like you.

You, who do not exercise the very least amount of courtesy to other people who do not share your beliefs. People like you who judge, bash, and belittle others at your whim as if you think you possess some form of superiority. Verily, this is ironic, contradicting and funny at the same time because it violates basic values found within the Bible. Moreover it is the epitome of arrogance and ignorance. I LOL at you for being such a hypocrite.

Still I am glad that the God found within your Bible is a God of Truth and Love--an exact opposite to the "God " that you have presented here. The "God" that you have shown here is a "God" of your own and wrong interpretation. A "God" that you use to condemn others. A "God" that you use as a tool of fear. A "God" which is undeniably, imperfect and false.

Know this good sir, this will be my first and last reply to you as I have no intention of discussing things with you. You have proved only one thing here.

You do not have an open and critical mind.

All discussions with you would be futile and impossible. If I am to reply, I will level with you. Your logic is that of 4-year-old(maybe even less) hence, all you will get is a "Lol", a "hahahahha" , a "ROFL" , or a smiley face. For you and only you will I practice your mode of condescension.

Again I LOL at you and people like you.

@kalieope

Do not feed the troll. The more you hate/feed it, the stronger it will get. If it's answers you seek, I can't tell you excatly how to find it or know where it is. But I do know where it isn't. It lies not in the hands of a self-righteous hypocrite. You'll only get lost with false prophets. But may I suggest you watch Part 1 of Zeitgeist (or the whole documentary and its sequel). It might shed some light. Peace! :D

Sa mga atheists ng pilipinas paano kayo nakaka fit in sa working world na majority ay katoliko? ano nilalagay niyo sa resume, o sinasabi sa interview alam ko sa iba naman hindi importante ito pero malamang may mga may ari o interviewer na importante ito, kung sakali, sasabihin niyo ba ang totoo? o magsisinungaling na lang

question ko lang... provide me an empirical data that would say that a supreme being exists... or let's turn it around..provide me an empirical data that would say that no supreme being exists...

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"そのままが一番。"
Hey! Say! 7 の山田涼介。

LOL you dont turn it around.
there is a spaghetti monster roaming the outer space. if you cant prove me wrong, you ought to believe me. see how silly your proposition of turning it around.

### auto-merged ###

jingo said:

JuanaTomasa said:

jingo said:
and only the stupid or moron or imbecile disrespects the other person's belief.

lets say my belief includes chopping youre head off and offering your heart to the sun god, would you respect it?

sure. come here and try to chop my head off. i you can. are you a survivor of the inca empire?

i just gave you a chance to prove your claim, i dont know if you missed it or intentionally avoided the pit your argument is sure to go down to.

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Scientia est lux lucis

juana, don't you find your question impertinent?

please don't get me wrong if i say that respect begets the same. you're asking me if i will respect a religion as that of the "uncivilized" inca empire (you sure watched the dragging, theatrically imbalanced "apocalypto", right?), & my answer will always be SURE. i have no qualms about their belief. in fact, i don't care about what they believe in. do you?

and, again, if you're one of the remaining south american empire, will you chop my head off? & again, my answer (to my own question) will be SURE.

an impertinent question draws an even more impertinent answer. dig?

-----
old habits die hard. tsk!

para kay sir eideteker:
napanood ko po yung pelikula nung isang araw sir eideteker. that was a &#@$% of information! parang andaming pintuan ang nabuksan saking isipan. hindi naman po sa naniniwala po ako agad pero posible nga pong ganun ang nangyari at nangyayari sa paligid natin. oo nga po't nakikita natin yung resulta sa mga pinaggagawa nila pero hindi pa rin po natin ma confirm kung lahat ng detalyeng nakasaad doon sa pelikula ay totoo. pero inuulit ko po, posible talagang may katotohanan ang lahat. salamat po sir sa pagbahagi. okay pa naman po si hojle sakin sir e. at least naman po may makakausap dito.

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If faith were rational, it wouldn't be - by definition - faith.
- Eat Pray Love by Elizabeth Gilbert -

@ kalieope

Astig. Of course to blindly believe everything in it would be wrong. You must also do your own research. What's important is to keep an open mind and be critical about the things we've been told and shown. :D

Panoorin mo rin yung Zeitgeist: Addendum. Maganda yun at may minumungkahi rin sila dung solusyon. Exciting at parang possible yung mga sinasabi dun sa documentary.

I find the pathetic notion of conformity and the incessant fawning abundant in this thread, I am about to puke in disgust.

The pertinence of Juana's question is only but pertinent, I find that you cannot answer her facile question directly Jingo. Will you respect her and her religion if she was to mutilate you, dismember you, and disembowel you for the sake of her religion? You had to cite the ridiculous movie Apocalypto which is totally impertinent to this whole discussion. Will you respect her if she was to torture you for her religion? As simple as yes or no. You say "SURE" which would more likely mean as "MAYBE". Is it a SUREly Yes or a SUREly no. Just say either for the record and be on your way.

Respecting other religions does NOT BEGET respect back from them. This is a problem of Free Will, Morality, and a general idea of Morality common to a communal thinking. Understand that the precepts of thinking lie in relative perceptions and deductions of the world. Ever heard of the phrase, "What cures Sancho makes Martha sick"? In a way, this relates to what I said. You cannot say respect begets respect for the sole reason that the individuality of the human mind produces different thinking. If you can tell me that both you and Juana can think of the same thing at the same time, all the time then truly you can say respect begets respect.

If you will, show us the manual where it shows that all human beings MUST respect each others' religion? If you can't, please don't waste everyone's time. Remember that Ethics is based on the concept of general acceptance however it didn't strictly define that everyone must follow it nor it did say that it favors virtue.

Imagine an anarchistic world where the code of ethics is to pillage, rape, murder, discrimination, and dominate. Then each person had his OWN religion. Now does this dictate that they will respect each other at all?

Now, my case and point, your idea of respecting other people's religions and them begetting that said respect is only applicable to you and the people who believes the same. You TOLERATE People that who don't. Now if you claim that I am putting words in your mouth, then tell me, do you respect the following people for their religion or do you respect them as a person; Hitler and the other Nazis, Extremist Muslims (Note: The ones who will go suicidal on you), Jim Jones, etc.

Now I, in particular, don't want to hear an explanation. Just a simple yes or no. Do you respect those people for their religion or do you respect them as people? If you say that you respect their religion and themselves, then I would say it is hypocrisy. If you say you do NOT respect them, then at the very least you have tolerated them. Thus, proving that interactions with other religions is religious tolerance.

By simple semantics, this can be figured out:

Tolerance = sympathy or indulgence for beliefs or practices differing from or conflicting with one's own

Respect = high or special regard : esteem.

Surely, Sympathy is not equal to HIGH REGARD.

A simple analogy for everyone to understand. If Pedro, who is a co-worker of Jose and Juan, buys a new car that can easily be purchased by everyone and he flaunts it around all the time. Does that mean Juan and Jose will automatically respect him for it? Will they tolerate him for his insolent behavior?

It's the same thing, having whatever religion doesn't command respect at all. If you were to disprove me, use my examples given to cross examine yourself first.

Dodging questions and giving unrelated answers draws criticism to oneself. Dig?


I thought Juana wasn't the status quo of thinking here but I was surely mistaken. The gap gets bigger.

-----
Ang engot nasasaktan sa salitang engot. Ang umiyak dahil nasabihan ng engot ay malala pa sa engot. Kung ang pagaaral ay nagdudulot ng kaengotan katulad ng mga tao sa TDP, buti na lang hindi ako nag-aral at naging janitor na lang!

Fornicaras said:
I find the pathetic notion of conformity and the incessant fawning abundant in this thread, I am about to puke in disgust.

The pertinence of Juana's question is only but pertinent, I find that you cannot answer her facile question directly Jingo. Will you respect her and her religion if she was to mutilate you, dismember you, and disembowel you for the sake of her religion? You had to cite the ridiculous movie Apocalypto which is totally impertinent to this whole discussion. Will you respect her if she was to torture you for her religion? As simple as yes or no. You say "SURE" which would more likely mean as "MAYBE". Is it a SUREly Yes or a SUREly no. Just say either for the record and be on your way.

Respecting other religions does NOT BEGET respect back from them. This is a problem of Free Will, Morality, and a general idea of Morality common to a communal thinking. Understand that the precepts of thinking lie in relative perceptions and deductions of the world. Ever heard of the phrase, "What cures Sancho makes Martha sick"? In a way, this relates to what I said. You cannot say respect begets respect for the sole reason that the individuality of the human mind produces different thinking. If you can tell me that both you and Juana can think of the same thing at the same time, all the time then truly you can say respect begets respect.

If you will, show us the manual where it shows that all human beings MUST respect each others' religion? If you can't, please don't waste everyone's time. Remember that Ethics is based on the concept of general acceptance however it didn't strictly define that everyone must follow it nor it did say that it favors virtue.

Imagine an anarchistic world where the code of ethics is to pillage, rape, murder, discrimination, and dominate. Then each person had his OWN religion. Now does this dictate that they will respect each other at all?

Now, my case and point, your idea of respecting other people's religions and them begetting that said respect is only applicable to you and the people who believes the same. You TOLERATE People that who don't. Now if you claim that I am putting words in your mouth, then tell me, do you respect the following people for their religion or do you respect them as a person; Hitler and the other Nazis, Extremist Muslims (Note: The ones who will go suicidal on you), Jim Jones, etc.

Now I, in particular, don't want to hear an explanation. Just a simple yes or no. Do you respect those people for their religion or do you respect them as people? If you say that you respect their religion and themselves, then I would say it is hypocrisy. If you say you do NOT respect them, then at the very least you have tolerated them. Thus, proving that interactions with other religions is religious tolerance.

By simple semantics, this can be figured out:

Tolerance = sympathy or indulgence for beliefs or practices differing from or conflicting with one's own

Respect = high or special regard : esteem.

Surely, Sympathy is not equal to HIGH REGARD.

A simple analogy for everyone to understand. If Pedro, who is a co-worker of Jose and Juan, buys a new car that can easily be purchased by everyone and he flaunts it around all the time. Does that mean Juan and Jose will automatically respect him for it? Will they tolerate him for his insolent behavior?

It's the same thing, having whatever religion doesn't command respect at all. If you were to disprove me, use my examples given to cross examine yourself first.

Dodging questions and giving unrelated answers draws criticism to oneself. Dig?


I thought Juana wasn't the status quo of thinking here but I was surely mistaken. The gap gets bigger.

this is the point (the line you've posted that i've quoted in bold), fornicaras, that i find very meaningful. and since we're not playing the same language game here, i'm not going to light the fire.

sure, i cannot always say "respect begets the same." and sure, you have your own take on my "sure" answer. and hell sure, the line IS ONLY applicable to me and the other people who believes the same. sure!

i just find you people (very) reactionary. i won't expound on this anymore. and i won't react on your reactions to this post either. and if you find my post very flimsy, i don't mind. not at all.

now, back to juana's question (forget apocalypto), my answer will be SURE.

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old habits die hard. tsk!

I take it that you acknowledge that Tolerance is the appropriate word for it, not respect.

Your subtle admission is enough to stand on its own. You just proved and admitted the point that I was driving, I like it btw. I liked your subtle nod to my points however I dislike your silent omission on your point/s whatsoever. Are you declaring a tactical retreat?

(Very) Reactionary? I find that a farcical idea. This IS a forum, and supposedly, it is a place where ideas are exchanged. This isn't a monologue for you or for me. Thereby, anything that we say in this forum, is grounds for receiving a response (regardless if we do get it or not). Again, It is a conversation, not a monologue. It's a concept called "Call and Response". I believe it was once said that if one cannot stand the heat, get off the kitchen.

I'd just like to state that the lack of opinion often opts to withdrawal of proclamation. However, I must say that the idea of withdrawal on this instance is not only sensible but a good saving-face move, nice move. I like the silent withdrawal.

Now, let us give you a round of applause. Tactical retreat is what they call it. Commendable IMO. Thank you for your inputs.


I still am puzzled as to how you can't say "YES" (Pardon my audacity if I was to assume that you are trying to say yes but cannot say so). And if you are saying that you'd respect her even if she will literally mutilate you for her religion, I'd still say hypocrisy. Is it really that hard to say that you do not respect her religion but you'll tolerate it?

-----
Ang engot nasasaktan sa salitang engot. Ang umiyak dahil nasabihan ng engot ay malala pa sa engot. Kung ang pagaaral ay nagdudulot ng kaengotan katulad ng mga tao sa TDP, buti na lang hindi ako nag-aral at naging janitor na lang!

^ sure.

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old habits die hard. tsk!

teka po makikiraan, sasagot lang po ako kay sir eideteker. hwag nyo po kong idamay ha? :)
done 50%. napanood ko na rin po pero di ko pa natapos. ng dahil sa pera ano po? technology? yun ang solusyon? kaso po sinasabotahe po yata ng mga malalaking kompanya yung mga mga teknolohiya na nakakasira sa kanilang profit. pero parang wala na po yata tayo sa topic. hihihi. saan kaya pwedeng pag usapan ang ganito?

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If faith were rational, it wouldn't be - by definition - faith.
- Eat Pray Love by Elizabeth Gilbert -

jingo said:
juana, don't you find your question impertinent?

please don't get me wrong if i say that respect begets the same. you're asking me if i will respect a religion as that of the "uncivilized" inca empire (you sure watched the dragging, theatrically imbalanced "apocalypto", right?), & my answer will always be SURE. i have no qualms about their belief. in fact, i don't care about what they believe in. do you?

and, again, if you're one of the remaining south american empire, will you chop my head off? & again, my answer (to my own question) will be SURE.

an impertinent question draws an even more impertinent answer. dig?

@Jingo, if the person they sacrifice for the sake of their religion is someone important to you (i.e. family member or a friend), will you still respect them? Will you still respect their religion? Can you still say that you don't care with what they believe? If that's the case, then, can I safely assume that you will just let it slide without any counter measure (after them butchering your loved one) since doing so will be a disrespect for them and their religion?

I may not be as smart as you are Jingo but I don't see any impertinence on Juana's part. I believe she asked a very good question. Can you prove me wrong? I don't mind being wrong.

@Holje, I don't see any logic with all the things you said. It seems like, when you say it's red it is red, even though it is still open for discussion whether it's red or dark orange. That those who doesn't agree with you are evil. Can't you have an open mind? Question. What will happen to people who have never heard about Jesus or religion (like people from some undiscovered place) but have never done anything wrong with respect to Christian standard? Will they go to hell? If yes, why?

Also, I don't see any logic that when I burn my feet I will realize that there really is GOD. The only thing that I will realize is how stupid I am to burn my own feet. I know that fire is real because I can see it and I can feel the heat it causes. How is it to prove that GOD exists? I may be the dumbest person on Earth not to get your logic, but can you please explain this to me? Kahit tagalog ok lang. If you really care, explain to us cleary and logically.

Overtime: Do you think the people who are responsible writing the bible knew that the Earth was round and not flat and has no edge? That it was the Earth that revolve around the Sun and not the other way around?

Maraming salamat po in advance in enlightening a stupid individual.

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My mediocrity is average... hahaha...

This thread started out with calm, non-judgemental and critical/semi-critical posts from other people. But unfortunately your bigotry has killed it. Honestly good sir to a certain extent, I respect people like you. People who are firm in their beliefs, people who read and know what they are talking about. However, you are brainwashed, a bigot, and have excessive amounts of self-righteousness which I, and other people here, makes it hard or even impossible to even have the slightest amount of respect for you.

there is one thing we differ; “my judgment”, as you consider it as mine, are words taken from the Judge Himself – from His words - the Bible. your judgment, as you said “brainwashed, bigot, and have excessive amount of self-righteousness”, comes from your own thoughts, heart and thus comes out from your mouth.
it is surely a big difference.

The topic says "Atheism", the sub-heading: "The idea of believing that no supreme deity/deities exist". And this is a forum. Each is entitled to his/her opinion and to be able to discuss that opinion. Like others you have done this--only in an exorbitant manner--to the point where you sound like a pharisee. This is a very disgusting and dangerous thing for a Christian like you.

i believe it should be the other way around. for pharisees are not living in the truth.
is none existence of the supreme being a truth?
pls, don't insist in someone's lies.

I do not have a religion. But I do acknowledge the existence of the text and doctrines which you present and I respect that. And for the sake of discussion/argument/debate, I still keep an open mind to its validity. Moreover on a personal level, I don't have any problems with the Bible.

if you don’t have any problems with the Bible, then we could have meetings of mind.

Again the problem lies with people like you.

just be consistent.

You, who do not exercise the very least amount of courtesy to other people who do not share your beliefs. People like you who judge, bash, and belittle others at your whim as if you think you possess some form of superiority. Verily, this is ironic, contradicting and funny at the same time because it violates basic values found within the Bible. Moreover it is the epitome of arrogance and ignorance. I LOL at you for being such a hypocrite.

courtesy and respect on someone wrong is not gauged in silence, open mindedness, tolerance, etc. they are done by rebuking, correcting, and teaching the one in wrong.

Still I am glad that the God found within your Bible is a God of Truth and Love--an exact opposite to the "God " that you have presented here. The "God" that you have shown here is a "God" of your own and wrong interpretation. A "God" that you use to condemn others. A "God" that you use as a tool of fear. A "God" which is undeniably, imperfect and false.

prove it anyway.

Know this good sir, this will be my first and last reply to you as I have no intention of discussing things with you. You have proved only one thing here.

You do not have an open and critical mind.

why should one be open to falsehood and lies? God do not exist? this a lies and very false. so rebuke, correct and taught what is right anyway. not the right you thought to be right but the right that was inspired by God to be written and should be read.

All discussions with you would be futile and impossible. If I am to reply, I will level with you. Your logic is that of 4-year-old(maybe even less) hence, all you will get is a "Lol", a "hahahahha" , a "ROFL" , or a smiley face. For you and only you will I practice your mode of condescension.

Again I LOL at you and people like you.

none acceptance of truth is more futile that would eventually lead to death not only of our physical being but also of the spiritual.
well, that is really true. my logics are low. but the logic of God can never be fathomed, and measured. and I am not throwing you my logic anyway but His truth.
That One Truth is that God exist.
well, you laughed today. but just remember we met this very moment when His Coming time comes. I just hope you will continue to laugh with great joy and happiness on that day. most especially if repentance will happen to you before He comes. and I just hoped, one heart would be humbled and be repentant someday.
me, I am just thankful I meet you all here and gave me the opportunity to share.
truth really hurts. and being hurt is a good sign.

### auto-merged ###

@Holje, I don't see any logic with all the things you said. It seems like, when you say it's red it is red, even though it is still open for discussion whether it's red or dark orange.

is God existence still a question? doubt can lead us to death, bro! look what Eve had done. it caused you to die! now, is that the logic you want me to follow? that red is blue and blue is red? no way! only fools rush to such kind of logic!

That those who doesn't agree with you are evil. Can't you have an open mind?

I don’t want you to agree with me bro. but agree to the idea and the truth that God exist. that is the very truth that can never be changed. and it is not my idea but God’s! that He exist. and not only that. He also loves us and even died for us!

Question. What will happen to people who have never heard about Jesus or religion (like people from some undiscovered place) but have never done anything wrong with respect to Christian standard? Will they go to hell? If yes, why?

if you have that burden then go to them and tell them about JESUS. your burden could make what you have burdened possible. maybe God JESUS gave you that burden to let them know about Him. go instead.
also, is there any impossible with God that we should doubt God’s saving power?

Also, I don't see any logic that when I burn my feet I will realize that there really is GOD. The only thing that I will realize is how stupid I am to burn my own feet. I know that fire is real because I can see it and I can feel the heat it causes. How is it to prove that GOD exists? I may be the dumbest person on Earth not to get your logic, but can you please explain this to me? Kahit tagalog ok lang. If you really care, explain to us cleary and logically.

then, if someone is stupid to burn his feet then he or she had just made himself stupid for not believing in God.
to prove? then look at yourself and ask how come I exist with such order. and then just have faith that you were created.
and it is dumber not to believe.
faith is believing, accepting, trusting and obeying.

Overtime: Do you think the people who are responsible writing the bible knew that the Earth was round and not flat and has no edge? That it was the Earth that revolve around the Sun and not the other way around?

the writers concern was to have faith and write. if they had asked it from God, then they should have known it. no doubt here.
but so it is at God’s appointed divine time, He revealed it us that the Earth was round and not flat and has no edge; that it was the Earth that revolve around the Sun and not the other way around. and now we already know. thanks be to God who is the only source of wisdom and knowledge. most especially the knowledge of technology and its advancement.
in God’s Kingdom, all are advance. our present world is an opposite of it and will be made obsolete by it.

-----
Ho(ly)J(ESUS for)l(ife)e(ternal)
Holy Father, give us the spirit to understand Your words. Give us The Spirit to faithfully follow it. Lord come and reign! Free and save all Filipino brothers! Through Your Holy and Mighty Name JESUS we pray.Ame3X